HGH + metformin

[gesus]

I am running 10-15iu of hgh ED i split my doses into 3-4 iu / dose and pin every 4 hours. I am thinking of using glucophage (metformin) to help with insulin resistance that will come from using such dosages bc i feel that i am not ready to go for slin yet as i do not know the protocols like the back of my hand yet..My question is that I have heard that metformin hinders the livers ability to convert to IGF-1. How will this play a role since I am running such high levels of rHGH (am i wasting it or is it minuscule because of the amount and pulsing that i am doing in my protocol)? My diet is extremely clean sugars are very minimal and are timed out through out the day for when i believe my body will best utilize it from the foods in my diet. I am not that worried about it currently but as I see glucose levels rising I would like to know if this is the "safest" best alternative to using insulin. I have been finger prick testing every morning when I wake up to start learning how my body handles sugars and have the best plan of action for when the time comes. If anyone with any experience, research or stories would like to chime in, please do so! i am here to learn

thank you guys

 

[01dragonslayer]

This may help....

Metformin is used by itself or in combination with with GH to counter balance the negative effect of GH on insulin sensitivity. GH by its nature releases glucose (and fatty acids) to the circulation, this is part of it metabolic effect as a stress hormone. The raised blood sugar levels overloads the pancreas which leads in time to insulin resistance at least to some degree. Diet rich in high glycemic carbs has same effect to some extent, this is why some heavy duty athletes, who uses carb loading, especially post workout find the usage in insulin or metformin as helpful, it helps to balance the sugar levels and support the pancreas. Here is where the IGF1 shines, IGF1 is healthier, carries less side effects then Metformin, and certainly then insulin, and carries some distinct anabolic, metabolic and anti catabolic advantages that Metformin simply doesn't offer. IGF1 naturally balances the insulin levels and increases insulin sensitivity, helps to mobilize fatty acids which helps to reduce fat, in oppose to insulin which directly causes to store fat, and of course is known as the most anabolic hormone in the body and posses as shown in clinical literature below anti catabolic traits that even GH by itself fails to deliver.

 

[gesus]

This may help....

Metformin is used by itself or in combination with with GH to counter balance the negative effect of GH on insulin sensitivity. GH by its nature releases glucose (and fatty acids) to the circulation, this is part of it metabolic effect as a stress hormone. The raised blood sugar levels overloads the pancreas which leads in time to insulin resistance at least to some degree. Diet rich in high glycemic carbs has same effect to some extent, this is why some heavy duty athletes, who uses carb loading, especially post workout find the usage in insulin or metformin as helpful, it helps to balance the sugar levels and support the pancreas. Here is where the IGF1 shines, IGF1 is healthier, carries less side effects then Metformin, and certainly then insulin, and carries some distinct anabolic, metabolic and anti catabolic advantages that Metformin simply doesn't offer. IGF1 naturally balances the insulin levels and increases insulin sensitivity, helps to mobilize fatty acids which helps to reduce fat, in oppose to insulin which directly causes to store fat, and of course is known as the most anabolic hormone in the body and posses as shown in clinical literature below anti catabolic traits that even GH by itself fails to deliver.

correct, but does metformin blunt the conversion of the exogenous hgh to igf-1 in the liver?..I guess what I am asking is by taking the metformin in order to keep insulin sesitivity am i cancelling out the hgh? The main reason to have the hgh in the first place would be to get more igf-1 in the body. To my understanding IGF-1 is virtually impossible to get and extremely expensive to produce? I know that LR3 is available..does this carry similiar benefits? What options would someone have in order to combat the negative effects of blood glucose levels from taking high levels of hgh other than insulin usage?

Also, thank you for the quick reply always enjoy reading your feedback dragonslayer!

 

[01dragonslayer]

correct, but does metformin blunt the conversion of the exogenous hgh to igf-1 in the liver?..I guess what I am asking is by taking the metformin in order to keep insulin sesitivity am i cancelling out the hgh? The main reason to have the hgh in the first place would be to get more igf-1 in the body. To my understanding IGF-1 is virtually impossible to get and extremely expensive to produce? I know that LR3 is available..does this carry similiar benefits? What options would someone have in order to combat the negative effects of blood glucose levels from taking high levels of hgh other than insulin usage?

Also, thank you for the quick reply always enjoy reading your feedback dragonslayer!

Thats a great question unfortunately I can't give you a concrete answer.....guess I'm gonna have to do more research.

 

[01dragonslayer]

I found this article. Its fairly long but it yields a lot of good info and does reference taking exogenous HGH and its effects on insulin sensitivity.

A Basic Guide to HGH –

The intention of this guide is to give you a good basic working knowledge of HGH and how to intelligently use it. While this is not intended to cover every conceivable nuance of HGH use, it should provide you with a solid enough background to create your cycle around. I am not writing this as a scientific exposition or as an overly technical overview. I am writing this from the standpoint of a seven-year veteran of HGH use, and an athlete (yes even paid at times) that has used this as one of the tools in my arsenal. I have injected tens of thousands of IU’s of HGH into myself, and carefully monitored, tested, and experimented on myself. So with that disclaimer being made up front, lets take a look at this hormone called HGH.

Few other hormones have generated more excitement and hype in recent years than HGH. From reports of incredible fat loss to tales of increases in lean muscle to levels that defy genetics, HGH has been touted as one of the panaceas to all bodybuilding woes. Depending on which statistics you trust, reports of as many as 80% of professional athletes have experimented with, have used, or are actively using HGH as a supplement to their training program.


WHAT EXACTLY IS HGH?
Human Growth Hormone (somatotropin - also referred to as rHGH, HGH, or GH) is created by the pituitary gland, the primary form consisting of a 191 amino acid chain. When we are young, HGH is in big part responsible for the proper growth of bones, muscle, and other tissues. Too little of this hormone and we remain dwarfs … too much and we become giants and/or suffer from abnormal growth deformities. As we become adults, HGH is responsible for keeping muscles from wasting away, supports healthy immune system response, regulates aspects of our metabolic function dealing with increased fat metabolism and healthy body composition in later life, and maintains and repairs our skin and other tissues.

Our levels of HGH peak while we are adolescents and then begin to drop off sharply beginning in our 30’s. By our 60’s, our daily HGH secretion can be as little as 10% of what it was during our youth. Many of the markers of aging are affected by this decrease in HGH. Some of the results of this are:

· Increase in fat.
· Decrease in muscle and lean body structures.
· Decreased skin texture resulting in a less youthful appearance.
· Decreased bone density, onset of osteoporosis.
· Decreased brain function, loss of intellect with aging.
· Decreased sex drive.
· Decrease in overall physical and mental well being.
· Increase in sleep disorders, lower quality of sleep.
· Depression and fatigue.

The addition of supplemental HGH beginning in the latter 30’s can reverse or improve these symptoms in the majority of people attempting therapy. This is why you will often hear references with respect to HGH as “the fountain of youth” and other similar terms. It can present a better quality of life for those aging.

HOW IS HGH RELEASED IN YOUR BODY?
HGH is secreted from the pituitary in a pulsatile fashion, generally following a circadian rhythm. A number of stimuli can initiate an HGH secretion, the most powerful being short duration, high intensity exercise and sleep. During the first few hours of sleep (deep sleep stages – about 2 hours after you fall asleep), Somatostatin is turned off and GHRH is turned on, resulting in HGH pulses.

Growth Hormone Releasing Hormone (GHRH) produced by the hypothalamus stimulates HGH secretion. HGH, and IGF-1 create a negative feedback loop, meaning when their levels are high; it blunts release of GHRH, which in turn blunts the release of more HGH.

Somatostatin (SS), secreted by the hypothalamus as well as other tissues inhibits the secretion of HGH Somatostatin in response to GHRH and to other stimulatory factors such as low blood glucose concentration. High levels of IGF-1 also stimulate Somatostatin secretion.

Ghrelin is a peptide hormone secreted from the stomach. Ghrelin binds to receptors on somatotrophs and potently stimulates secretion of growth hormone. Ghrelin, as the stimulator for the growth hormone secretagogue receptor, potently stimulates secretion of growth hormone. The ghrelin signal is integrated with that of growth hormone releasing hormone and somatostatin to control the timing and magnitude of growth hormone secretion.

Once HGH is released, it is very short lived. It is generally metabolized and gone within a half-hour. During this half-hour, it travels to the liver and other tissues and induces them to secrete a polypeptide hormone called Insulin-like Growth Factor One (IGF-1).

HOW DOES HGH DO ITS WORK?
As mentioned above, HGH is short lived, but during its short half-hour or so activity per burst from the pituitary, it exerts itself through direct and indirect effects.

Its direct effects are the result of the HGH binding its receptor on target cells. Fat cells (adipocytes) as well as myocytes (muscle cells) have HGH receptors. On fat cells, HGH stimulates them to break down triglyceride and suppresses the fat cells ability to uptake circulating lipids.

Its indirect effects are in the process we described in the section above. When HGH travels to the liver, one of the results of its pass through the liver is the livers secretion of IGF-1. When this IGF-1 is secreted, it stimulates proliferation of chondrocytes (cartilage cells), which result in bone growth. It also plays a part in stimulating both the proliferation and differentiation of myoblasts (the precursor to skeletal muscle fibers). IGF-1 also stimulates amino acid uptake and protein synthesis in muscle and other tissues. Other tissues (muscle, etc.) are acted on by the presence of HGH, also inducing their release of IGF-1.

HGH stimulates protein anabolism in many tissues. This reflects increased protein synthesis, decreased oxidation of proteins, and increased amino acid uptake. As mentioned above, HGH enhances fat utilization by stimulating triglyceride breakdown and oxidation in fat cells (adipocytes).

HGH can affect the function of other hormones. HGH can suppress the abilities of insulin to stimulate the uptake of glucose in tissues and enhance glucose synthesis in the liver, though administering HGH actually stimulates insulin secretion and can create a state of hyperinsulinemia. This combination can lead to decreased insulin sensitivity, which in turn can lead to hyperglycemia. HGH can in the right circumstances also have a slight inhibitory effect on the function of our thyroid hormones (and actually vice versa as well), though this varies greatly from individual to individual. The vast majority of users have no need to worry about this at all. Others wishing to increase their metabolism or enhance certain of HGH’s functions may wish to consider low dose thyroid to their HGH cycle. We’ll offer some strategies later in this guide.

So, we are looking at a hormone that can assist with maintenance and healing of most of the body’s systems, can create new cartilage, bone, and muscle cells, can assist with protein uptake, decrease the oxidation of proteins, and can accelerate the rate at which fat is utilized. This paints the picture of the excitement that follows HGH. How then do we utilize this to our advantage? Let’s take a look at some strategies.

HOW DO I INCREASE MY LEVELS OF HGH?
There are a few strategies for increasing your own endogenous production of HGH. For the most part these aren’t going to give us a significant enough increase that would be necessary to promote all of the benefits mentioned above in their full measure, but for some (those still young) they will prove to be sufficient.

By adding several grams of Arginine and Glutamine to our daily supplement program, we can increase our levels of HGH. If we are very young or we are only in need of a modest jump in production, this may well do the trick. Short duration, high-intensity exercise (think heavy leg day – puking and all), will trigger our bodies to secrete a significant amount of HGH

Another possibility is to inject various related hormones or peptides. There are many available, such as GHRH, GHRP (and all of its analogs), and the like. These peptides are available from research companies and when injected at doses of 100mcgs per day, sub-q it does seem to show promise in increasing levels of HGH. At this stage the game, there isn’t a significant cost advantage to this over rHGH, but if we are trying to promote some of the other forms of HGH in addition to the primary form, or have no hope of securing a prescription for HGH (or other means of access) there may be an advantage to this course of action. Aside from these strategies, what are we left with? To state it simply, we need to inject exogenous rHGH.

INJECTIBLE HGH AND ITS USE
True HGH only comes in the form of a lyophilized powder. Any other form that you see advertised or run across is NOT the real deal. The only way to administer true HGH is by sub-q or intramuscular injection. You will see studies that use IV as their method of administration, but that is certainly NOT recommended (in fact it is just outright crazy), nor necessary in any way for getting all of the benefits HGH has to offer.

HGH is somewhat fragile by nature, and it needs to be protected from light and heat. HGH should be stored between 36 and 46 degrees Fahrenheit at all times both before and after its reconstitution.

There are a couple of American brands of HGH that can survive in normal room temperature for a reasonable amount of time BEFORE reconstitution (Genotropin – 3 months, Saizen – until expiration), but for the most part it is better to err on the side of safe rather than sorry. All brands of HGH should be refrigerated after being reconstituted, and all brands should be protected from light at all times.

RECONSTITUTING AND MEASURING YOUR HGH
So you now have a vial HGH in the form of lyophilized powder. The amount of this powder should be indicated on the vial somewhere. It will either be stated in Units (IU's) or in Milligrams (mg). If it is stated in milligrams, the conversion is most commonly stated as 1mg = ~3IU's (its really more precisely 1mg=2.7IU). We will use this 1mg = 3IU's for our guide since this is the standard most commonly referenced by manufacturers.

What we need to do with this lyophilized powder is add some Bacteriostatic water (BW), Sterile Water, or even liquid vitamin B12 to reconstitute it and make it ready to inject.

What we choose to reconstitute it with should depend on how rapidly we use the GH. Bacteriostatic water is basically sterile water with 0.9% Benzyl Alcohol added, and this Alcohol keeps anything from growing in the water, thus making it safe for injection for the longest amount of time, up to three weeks. If the amount of GH in our vial is enough to last for a few weeks at our desired daily dosage, BW is the wisest choice. For the common use for bodybuilding (2-5 IU's a day) and the more commonly used vial size (10 IU's), it isn't really as critical which of the above listed dilutents are used … the vial will be used up long before bacteria or anything begins to grow in our reconstituted HGH. It is really personal preference outside of the considerations listed above.

RECONSTITUTING
1.) Take an alcohol swab and swab the stopper of both your HGH vial and the vial of the dilutent (BW, sterile water, B12).

2.) Take a 3cc syringe with a 23 or 25 gauge needle (1" or 1.5") and draw up and amount of your preferred dilutent. The amount isn't critical, other than making sure you know exactly how much you have used. The best rule of thumb is choose an amount that will make measuring the final product easy

example- 1ml(cc) per 10 IU vial of HGH would mean each 10 mark on a U100 slin syringe would equal 1 IU of HGH

2ml(cc) added to a 10 IU vial of HGH would mean that the 20 mark on a U100 syringe would equal 1 IU of HGH

3ml(cc) added to a 10 IU vial of HGH would mean that the 30 mark on a U100 syringe would equal 1 IU of HGH

3.) Take this syringe with the dilutent and push it into the vial of lyophilized powder, angling so that the needle touches the side of the vial, and avoiding shooting the dilutent directly on the lyophilized powder. Make it run slowly down the side of the vial (don't let it forcefully rush in).

4.) After all of the dilutent has been added to the HGH vial, gentling swirl (do NOT agitate or violently shake the vial) until the lyophilized powder has dissolved and you are left with a clear liquid. The HGH is now ready for use. Store your now reconstituted HGH in the refrigerator. If you used BW to reconstitute it will be good for three weeks. If you used sterile water, it will be good for about 5 days.

MEASURING
After you have successfully reconstituted your HGH, now you need to know how to measure the desired amount out for injection. You will want to use a U100 insulin syringe to draw out and inject your HGH.

Here is the way to figure out how much to draw out. Since you know the amount of IU's in your HGH vial, and you also know how much water you have diluted it with, we just divide this out as follows:

You will need to know the following to be successful -

1ml = 1cc = 100 IU's

So we take our number of IU's of HGH from the label of the dry lyophilized powder (most commonly 10 IU's for all of us Jintropin users), and we divide that into the amount of dilutent we used.

example- We used 1cc(ml) of water. We have a 10 IU vial of HGH.
From our formula above we know that 1cc = 100 IU's, so we have 100 IU's of water.
We now divide the 100 IU's (the amount of our water) by 10 IU's (the amount of our HGH)

100 IU / 10 IU = 10

This 10 will perfectly correspond with the markings on a U100 insulin syringe. In our example every 10 mark on our syringe will equal 1 IU of HGH. Want to draw out 2 IU's of GH? ....draw out to the 20 mark on the syringe.

This is about all there is to it. So to recap, just keep straight:

1.) How much actual HGH you are dealing with (read from the vial)
2.) How much water (dilutent) you are using to add to the actual HGH.
3.) Divide the amount of water in units by the amount of GH in units.
4.) This result will equal the measurement on your U100 Insulin syringe per unit of GH.
5.) multiply the number you get it step 4 by how many units you want to inject. This is the number to draw to on your syringe.

Now that we have a basic understanding of what HGH is, how it does its work, and how to reconstitute and measure it, lets look at some strategies for using this hormone to our best advantage.

STRATEGIES FOR USING HGH
There are many different approaches to taking HGH. The right approach for your particular situation will depend on your goals. For many, HGH is a general supplement to help maintain low bodyfat percentages and reasonable levels of lean body mass. For others who have reached their genetic potential for growth, HGH is a supplement that can assist in continued growth beyond what your parents gave you to work with. For yet others, it is a supplement that is used for general health and healing of injuries. Let’s look at each of these uses with respect to a reasonable HGH program.

For bodybuilders, HGH (and the IGF-1 that is a result of its use) is the only substance that can actually initiate hyperplasia, which in the interest of our use in bodybuilding equates to new muscle cells. While use of anabolic steroids can cause hypertrophy (the enlargement of existing muscle cells), steroids do not offer the ability to recruit and mature more muscle cells. HGH can. HGH also increases protein synthesis, which can be responsible for hypertrophy. HGH also strengthens and heals connective tissues, cartilage, and tendons. These uses are what make it so attractive to athletes in all sports, and in bodybuilding in particular.


To begin with, it should be stated that for the vast majority of HGH users, results are not rapid and earthshaking in nature. If your idea of using HGH is to get ripped in a few weeks, gaining 20 pounds of muscle in a matter of a month or two, or being miraculously healed in a matter of a few injections … you are likely in for a BIG disappointment. HGH does some pretty incredible things, but it HAS to be viewed as a long-term endeavor. A reasonable length HGH cycle would be 20-30 weeks in length. While you will always be able to find the one or two individuals who will make great strides in a short amount of time, the majority of us need to be dedicated to its use for the long haul for it to be a worthy venture.

As mentioned in our introduction to HGH, one of the major roles it plays in growth is by its acting on the liver, muscle cells, and other tissues, which in turn secretes IGF-1. This process is cumulative in nature, and it will take some time for your exogenous HGH use to bring your IGF-1 levels to create an environment conducive to optimal growth. While it is true that HGH begins shuttling nutrients to your muscles, and begins mobilizing fat from the first injection, these behind the scenes benefits will only be VISIBLE several weeks (up to 12) down the road.

DOSING

For anti-aging, general health & healing, fat mobilization
And other purposes such as these –
A dose of 2-3 IU’s per day (~10 – 15 IU’s per week) will be sufficient. A dose of 1.5 - 2.0 IU’s is considered to be a full replacement dose for those in their middle age. Given we will get somewhere in the neighborhood of 70-80% absorption and utilization from our subQ injections, our 2-3 IU’s will for all intents and purposes equate to a full replacement measure of HGH.

For gaining lean muscle and substantially improving body composition –
For this purpose a dose of 5-10 IU’s per day (~25-50 IU’s per week) will be necessary. Most people that still have an alive and kicking pituitary will respond very well at a dose of 5 IU's per day, though advanced bodybuilders and other large strength athletes will find that dose approaching 10 IU’s per day will be in order.
For maximum benefit in this regard, the addition of Testosterone and/or other anabolic should strongly be considered. For advanced use, other supplements like Insulin, and low-dose T3 or T4 would also be considerations.

Regardless of your goal, as a general rule the best way to begin your HGH program is to start with a low dose and ease your body into the higher doses. This will allow you to avoid (or at least minimize) many of the more common (and unpleasant) sides of HGH such as bloating and joint pain & swelling. Most people can tolerate up to approximately 2 IU’s per day with few sides, so that would be a good place to start.

For many using this as a general health supplement, that is as high as you will need to go. For others this will be only the start. Above 2.5 – 3 IU’s, I would definitely suggest that your split your injections into two per day instead of one unless it is just not feasible to do so. In my experiences, I have ran doses as high as 10 IU’s per injection, but at those doses I have suffered greatly with joint pain and bloating to the point of feeling like a Goodyear blimp. Also in my experimentation it seems that at least for me, keeping my individual doses down to 3-3.5 IU’s a piece, I more effectively elevate my IGF-1 levels while minimizing the need for mega-doses of HGH.

Here is what a good ramp up strategy would look like:
Weeks 1-4 = HGH 2 IU’s one injection
Week 5 = HGH 2.5 IU’s one injection
Week 6 = HGH 3.0 IU’s split into two injections of 1.5 IU’s each
Week 7 = HGH 3.5 IU’s split into two injections of 1.75 IU’s each
And so forth until you reach your desired dose.

If at any point in this progression you begin to have unbearable bloating or joint pain, drop the dose by 25% and hold it at this lower dosage for a couple of weeks. If the sides subside, begin your progression back up toward your desired level. If the sides remain, lower your dose again and hold it at the lower level for two weeks before beginning the upward progression. This method will keep your HGH experience a good one and side free for the most part.

For a normal cycle of 5-8 months in length, injecting once or twice a day, 7 days a week should be fine. While there are studies that suggest that the suppression and negative feedback from exogenous HGH is short lived (about 4 hours from time of injection), there are no large-scale studies to indicate safety of everyday injections in long-term use. There are studies by anti-aging groups demonstrating that a day or two off per week is adequate to protect the pituitary and its triggers over long cycles. If your use of HGH becomes more a lifestyle than a single cycle, I would consider running it 5 on/2 off, or 6 on/ 1 off until such time as we have reliable data demonstrating long-term safety sans any degradation of your own output or the triggers initiating that output. I have personally experimented with just about every conceivable injection strategy I could devise. What I can say about the anti-aging doctor’s supposition is that it panned out for me. I have recently come off of a 7-year run of HGH. I personally pull my own blood panels every six weeks routinely. After many months of being off of HGH, I now have the same profile I had before I began its use many years ago … high normal for my age. All levels and markers are perfectly normal.

Another option would be to run your HGH cycle everyday for the first two months to get your IGF-1 levels elevated quickly and to a level to assist you in an anabolic way, then drop back to 5 days a week. If you can tolerate the sides of higher doses, running the same weekly dose divided every other day is fine as well. The list goes on and frankly is an individual proposition. What seems to be of greatest import is that your weekly supplement of HGH is respectable enough to provide the desired benefit.

TIMING
As described above, the body produces HGH is a pulsatile fashion throughout the day with the heaviest pulses occurring approximately 2 hours or so after going to bed and as you fall into a deep sleep. Injectible HGH is completely absorbed and put to use within approximately 3 hours. The strategy with respect to timing depends somewhat on our age and the other elements of our cycle. As you will see below, there is no single best strategy … it depends a lot on your individual situation.

For those that are between their late 20’s and early 50’s, there is still a reasonable chance that your own endogenous production of HGH is at a reasonable level. The best time to take and injection, this being the case, would be early morning …. After your body’s own release of HGH in the night. If you get up to go to the bathroom in the early morning (3 -5am), this is probably the perfect time to take a couple of units of HGH. This will be the least disruptive time to take an injection of HGH. The second best time would be first thing in the morning when you wake up.

If you are splitting your doses, the two times of the day when your cortisol levels are at peak are when you wake up and in the early afternoon. This being the case, another good strategy is to take your HGH injections at these times. Cortisol is very catabolic by nature and a well -timed HGH injection can go a long way toward blunting this effect.

If you are in your late 50’s or beyond, or if for some reason you have a condition that has rendered your pituitary incapable of a normal release of HGH, a great time to take HGH is right before bed. This allows you to closely mimic the natural pattern that would occur if your pituitary were functioning properly. For the rest of us, taking your HGH right before bed is going to end up creating a negative feedback loop, robbing you of your body’s own nightly pulse of HGH. While the jury is still out (conflicting studies) as to the absolute nature of the negative feedback time, it is clear that the closer we push our injection to the time our body is ready to give us its biggest pulses of HGH, we are going to end up derailing our own triggers and secretion.

Yet another strategy should be considered if you are using insulin with your HGH. Insulin should be used immediately post workout. HGH and insulin do some great things together – they shuttle nutrients in a very complimentary way with each other, and the combination of HGH and Insulin create the best environment for IGF-1 production from the liver. If you are using insulin immediately post workout, taking a few IU’s of HGH pre-workout will allow HGH to offer all of its fat mobilizing effects while getting your HGH and Insulin to the liver at about the right time for huge IGF-1 releases.

SIDE EFFECTS – HOW TO MANAGE THEM
While HGH for the most part is well tolerated, there are some minor, mostly nuisance side effects that can occur. The biggest and most common side effect is bloating and joint pain. The chances of getting these can be minimized or even eliminated by utilizing the ramp up method discussed above in this guide.

If you are younger than your late 20’s, it would be very wise to enter an HGH cycle under the guidance of an MD, who can monitor and confirm whether your growth plates have fused. While abnormal bone growth with HGH use is not common, if used at the wrong point in your body’s development, it could cause disproportionate growth.

If you have a history of cancer or other tumors (at any age), it would be wise to get a complete checkup and be monitored by an MD to make sure that there are no active tumors before your HGH cycle. While HGH (and IGF-1) won’t cause cancer or tumors, they can create an environment that can allow already existing, active tumors to grow at an accelerated rate. We intentionally keep growth factor levels to a minimum in cancer patients. While tumors can create their own growth factors, we really don’t want to throw gas on the fire and allow them to grow any faster than they otherwise could.

Beyond these considerations, there really isn't anything specific that you would HAVE to take with HGH. There are supplements that you could take for specific conditions that are possible with HGH use. The way people react to HGH is a pretty individual thing. Some people get very little suppression of any kind; others don't see any gains from adding HGH because of significant enough suppression of one kind or another. Here's a general rundown of a few of the bigger ones.

For the slight thyroid support that may be desired:
conservative - take nothing
moderate - t-100x, bladderwrack, coleus forskolin, selenium, zinc, chromium, copper
aggressive - T3 at a dose of 12.5 - 25 mcgs or T4 at 100mcgs per day.

For the insulin resistance that is possible:
conservative - 300mg of Alpha Lipoic Acid and 200 - 300mcgs of Chromium Piccinolate
moderate - 15mg of Actos - a prescription med to increase insulin sensitivity, Glucophage (Metformin) to dispose of excess glucose and increase uptake in muscles.
aggressive - add a few IU's of insulin to your HGH cycle

For healthy test levels to best utilize HGH:
conservative - do nothing
moderate - use Tongkat or Tribulus
aggressive - add 200-300 milligrams (or more) of testosterone weekly to your HGH cycle

For protection against prostate growth:
conservative - do nothing
moderate - use Saw Palmetto (approx 2000mg)
aggressive - use Proscar or equivalent

For those that have a problem with breast tissue growth while on HGH:
For those that suffer from this, there is a difference of opinion as to the cause. In the presence of adequate estrogen, HGH can prompt growth of breast tissue. Also of consideration is that growth hormone, prolactin, and placental lactogen are a subfamily of a large 2-class cytokine superfamily of proteins. The amino acid sequences of hGH and hPL are similar (85% homology). In humans, each of these three proteins can bind hPRL receptors and promote a variety of physiological actions, including breast growth, lactation, and the like.
The current consensus seems to be that the best approach for those with this problem is twofold - Take 200mg of B6 (or Bromo if B6 is not sufficient) and also use 20-40mg of Tamoxifen (Nolva) to control this. If all else fails, a couple of months of Letro and Bromo will most certainly (and aggressively) deal with the problem. This is a pretty rare condition, but I have talked with more than a few bros that have reported this sort of problem.

Once again, I wouldn't say that all (or any) of these are necessary for everyone. I would use these supplements as necessary to correct whatever conditions arise with your own HGH use. As stated above, reaction to HGH (and just about anything else we use) is very individual.

Hopefully this guide has given you a better understanding of HGH and what it can do for you. HGH, especially when used in conjunction with an AAS cycle, will produce some high-quality, lean mass gains. It can also be used in conjunction with IGF-1 and insulin, which will be the topic of a comparative guide, that I will finish writing and get posted one of these days.

Happy growing! – RedBaron


And another good read....

Human Growth Hormone (HGH)
Human Growth Hormone (HGH) Dosing:

Month 1: HGH 2 IU one injection every other day
Months 2-4: HGH 3 IU one injection five days a week
Months 5-6: HGH 4 IU one injection five days a week
4-6 month cycles are optimal, year round if you are over age 35.
HGH

Human Growth Hormone (rHGH, HGH, or GH) is a protein molecule consisting of 191 amino acids. Genetically engineered recombinant human growth hormone is completely identical to the growth hormone made by the human pituitary gland. Researchers have proven growth hormone therapy can reverse the biological effects of aging. HGH is widely appreciated for aesthetics, not necessarily as a performance enhancer.



HGH is released in pulses that take place during the day. Growth hormone is rapidly converted in the liver to its powerful growth promoting metabolite, Insulin like Growth Factor. IGF-1 is measured in the blood to determine the level of growth hormone secretion. Most of the beneficial effects of human growth hormone are directly attributable to IGF-1. Growth hormone replacement/stimulation is the most effective therapy to reverse the effects of aging.


At age 30 people have people have spent most of their lives with relatively high levels of HGH. HGH is responsible for growth during childhood as well as for repair and regeneration of tissue. By the time we are 30 our bodies no longer naturally produce enough GH to handle the damage that is taking place. As this continues, we age. Increasing HGH in our bodies, we can slow, or even reverse many of the manifestations of aging.

What HGH can do:

* Reduce excess body fat, especially abdominal fat. (The reduction of abdominal fat is the single most profound effect of HGH replacement in many people)
* Decrease in the waist to hip ratio. (Meaning fat is removed primarily from around the waist where it is associated with a high risk of coronary disease)
* Increase muscle mass. (and physical strength if combined with moderate exercise)
* Reduce wrinkling of the skin and some other effects of skin aging. (Compliments can be Melanotan and MT-II)
* Re-grow certain internal organs that have atrophied with age.
* Increase bone density.
* Strengthen the immune system.
* Enhanced feeling of well being.
* Reverse cognitive decline.
* Stimulate production of the bone marrow cells that produce red blood cells.
* Reduce the probability that you will spend the last years of your life in a nursing home.
* HGH slows the progression of cardiovascular disease, and reduces the risk of death from cardiovascular disease, in individuals with natural growth hormone levels that are below average for the age of the individual. HGH can also slow the progression of cardiovascular disease by improving one's cholesterol profile. There is increasing evidence over the past year or two that maintaining healthy growth hormone levels results in a stronger heart. Individuals with low growth hormone levels have an overall increased risk of death due to cardiovascular disease. Low growth hormone levels cause a particularly large increase in the risk of stroke as compared with individuals receiving growth hormone replacement.


HGH takes several weeks to months of use benefit from its effects. There are a number of substances that increase the natural secretion of HGH. Some of them are amino acids. The relationship of certain amino acids to growth hormone is complex and varies greatly among different individuals and among individuals of different ages. All absolute and universal statements made about this subject are clearly false.



HGH is a peptide that comes in the form of lyophilized powder. Any other form that you see advertised or run across is likely NOT the real deal. The only way to administer true HGH is by sub-q or intramuscular injection. Be aware that HGH is not anabolic by itself. Careful measures need to be in place during reconstitution.

Reconstituting common HGH, one vial contains powdered freeze-dried HGH and the other vial contains sterile water with a bacteriostatic preservative. When the user is ready to begin, a certain amount of the sterile water is drawn out of the second vial (with a needle and syringe) and injected into the first vial to dissolve the powdered HGH. The solution is then ready for injection. The unused portion is to be kept refrigerated. Use reconstituted HGH within 3 or 4 weeks.

HGH peptide is dissolved by the user because HGH powder is much more durable. The dissolved HGH is very susceptible to being attacked by bacteria and degraded by enzymes. HGH is normally refrigerated, but if HGH powder is is left at room temperature for a few hours, no harm is done as long as the room is not too warm. Sterile powdered HGH can even be left in a cool room for days or weeks, but this is not a good idea. Even the powdered HGH can deteriorate if the temperature rises slightly above normal room temperature for any significant period of time.

The best way to begin HGH is to start with a low dose and ease your way into higher doses. This will allow you to avoid (or at least minimize) many of the more common sides of HGH such as bloating and joint pain. Most can tolerate 1-2 IU per day with few sides. HGH administration should be done on an empty stomach as fats and carbohydrates blunt release. Natural production of GH is 1 IU, give or take a half. For results in athletes the dosing should attempt to duplicate how the body releases the hormone naturally. Learning how much and when to best dose is very individual. My apologies for the dosing chart above.


For bodybuilders growth hormone is best taken in conjunction with insulin, anabolics/androgens, and thyroid hormone. Insulin is extremely effective with HGH as the injections cause a down regulation of insulin sensitivity in the body.


Half life of HGH is 2 hours when injected sub-q with a four hour period which there is a suppression of naturally produced GH. Intramuscular injections shorten the half life. Subcutaneous injections over the long term can lead to spot reduction. Whether or not HGH has any localized benefit from IM injection is unknown, but speculated.


HGH is tightly regulated by the FDA, but HGH is not a controlled substance on the federal level in the United States.


Insulin is one of the most powerful anabolic agents in the world. Used properly, it can add weight to you more quickly than any other compound at our disposal.

Used improperly, insulin will kill you.

Before I delve too deeply into explaining this compound, I feel that it’s important to stress that last part: Screw up with this stuff, and you die. You will go into a coma, and die. And I'm talking about simply taking too much of this stuff once.

Ok?

This drug needs to be treated with caution. If you aren't willing to read as much as possible on insulin before using it, then you aren't ready to use it at all.

So first, lets talk about the insulin that’s floating around in your body right now, and what it does; then we’ll talk about how adding exogenous insulin (insulin from outside your body) could possibly help you.

Insulin is a protein secreted by the pancreas which acts on the liver to stimulate the formation of glycogen from glucose and to inhibit the conversion of non-carbohydrates into glucose. Insulin also promotes facilitated diffusion of glucose through cells with insulin receptors, and of course this means muscle tissue(1). As you may expect, very high concentrations of insulin have been soundly result in markedly stimulated muscle protein synthesis (2)(3)(4)(9). It does this mainly at the translational level by enhancing peptide chain initiation (11). This property and it’s consequent results are probably the things which makes it most interesting to bodybuilders and athletes. This is because those factors combine to make ingested protein more efficient by promoting the transport of amino acids into muscle cells. Ergo, we can clearly say that insulin is undoubtedly anabolic in muscle tissue. It also has an anabolic effect in bone, and thereby increases bone density as well (. Another mechanism by which insulin is anabolic is via increasing your body’s IGF (Insulin-like Growth Factor) levels (6). IGF is an extremely anabolic hormone.

Another unexpected aspect of insulin use is it’s ability to increase both LH (Leutenizing Hormone) and FSH (Follicle Stimulating Hormone), both of which in turn stimulate testosterone production. What I’m getting at here is that insulin stimulates gonadotropin secretion, meaning that it’s use may actually provide an anabolic effect through increasing your HPTA’s ability to stimulate the production of testosterone (Hypothalamic-Pituitary-Testicular-Axis)(11) This effect is often manifested as virilization (development of male sexual characteristics) in women. Insulin also increases the binding ability of anabolic steroids to the androgen receptors (14),which would clearly suggest strongly the possibility of a synergistic effect of insulin when combined with steroids. Most people also think that insulin has some anabolic synergy when combined with growth hormone, and certainly there is alot of anecdotal evidence for this as well. In addition to anecdotal research, it's important to note that Insulin is actually so anabolic that some researchers have speculated that Growth Hormone’s (GH) ability to stimulate Protein Synthesis may actually be,in part, due to GH’s ability to increase insulin sensitivity (12). Certainly the complex relationship between insulin, IGF, and GH is very synergistic and all interrelated to each other’s actions (13)(15)(16)(17). Using all three of them plus anabolic steroids and a fat-burner is the most potent muscle-building & fat -burning cycle possible.

Of course, when something seems too good to be true, it usually is… Unfortunately, the bad news is that insulin can easily stimulate adipose (fat) storage. Generally, though, most bodybuilders take insulin with a fat burner or 2 (Thyroid meds are the most popular choice), as well as anabolic steroids and sometimes even GH and IGF, for reasons previously explained. All of this adds up to decreasing the chance that fat is stored, and greatly increases the amount of muscloe that will be gained.

Anyway, as you probably guessed, endogenous insulin (the stuff naturally found in your body) operates on feedback from within your body.
When your glucose levels get high, which is what happens when you eat a sugary snack, insulin is then released from your beta cells. When glucose is low, insulin is, of course, low.

In fact, simply adding liquid glucose to a liquid amino-acid meal (thereby raising insulin levels) will increase the absorption of the ingested amino acids by roughly 50%!(7) Now, think about this: If a natural insulin response to ingested glucose can give you 50% better absorption of protein, think about how much protein absorption injecting it will give you…

So, now that we have some kind of understanding as to what endogenous insulin does, lets try to figure out exactly what exogenous insulin can do (that’s the kind you get from a bottle…). Medically, of course, insulin is used to treat diabetes...thus becoming diabetic is a real risk with improper insulin usage.

First, I’m going to give you some clinical examples of how insulin has been used as an anti-catabolic agent. In the first study I read, insulin levels were increased 15-fold in infants suffering extreme catabolism. This level of insulin administration produced a 32% reduction in protein breakdown (4). In the second study I read exogenous insulin impeded muscle protein loss in burn victims(5). It’s important to note that you MUST have enough amino acids (protein) in your body for insulin to exert an anabolic effect. If there are not enough amino acids floating around in your body from your last few meals, insulin will not be anabolic at all. On the other hand, If amino acid concentrations are maintained at normal or high levels as they would be in a typical athlete or bodybuilder’s diet, a net protein deposition in muscle will occur (more protein deposited in your muscle = more mucle gained). This effect of insulin depositing protein in your muscles is primarily because of an actual stimulation of protein synthesis and also owing to an inhibition of protein breakdown (10). The lesson here is that even with insulin, diet is the key to it all. You need to have enough protein in order to build muscle, regardless of how much insulin you take.

Lets quantify this a bit. What about the anabolic and anti-catabolic properties of insulin…? Can we put some solid numbers on any of this?

Sure.

From the following chat, you can see that insulin puts your protein balance into a much more beneficial state, and concomitantly lowers protein degradation by inhibition of the lysosomal pathway (this is it’s anti-catabolic effect) (11) and raises protein synthesis (this is it’s anabolic effect).



Protein kinetics. Protein balance, degradation, and synthesis rates are shown (measured in nmol phenylalanine • min 1 • 100 ml 1). Values represent means ± SE for the basal (open bars) and last 30 min of the insulin infusion (filled bars) periods with the 3 different rates of amino acid infusion (in ml • min 1 • kg 1) (* P < 0.05 and ** P < 0.01 for basal vs. infusion period).(5)

What this chart tells me is that insulin can effeciently utilize a great deal of protein above and beyond what your body could normally utilize, and that if you should decide to use insulin, you should be taking in at least 2.2g/kg of bodyweight, and preferably 3-4.5g/kg of bodyweight.

So now we know how & why insulin works, and how well it works. Ok… lets figure out how to use it. I’ll give you two basic ideas on how to safely use insulin, as well as a third “hybrid idea,” and a dirty little trick on how to use insulin with a cyclic ketogenic diet, to get into ketosis earlier.

Whichever way you decide to use, remember, insulin has the ability to stimulate fat storage, so you want to make sure you are using anabolic steroids with it, as they will preferentially drive protein and nutrients towards being used for the accumulation of lean body mass over adipose tissue (fat). Personally, I also like to use a thyroid medication (Synthroid) to further insure none of my injectable insulin is going to put any fat on me. If you've been paying attention up until now, I'm sure I don't have to tell you that GH and IGF are also very potent (and expensive) additions to any stack containing insulin. If all of that didn't whet your appetite, then consider the fact that insulin, GH, and IGF are undetectable on drug tests! Currently, there's speculative ways to test for them, but nothing consistent has been established. I suspect that many a top level "natural" bodybuilder has been helped out by insulin, GH, and IGF.

So now that we know something about insulin, lets see what kind is most appropriate for bodybuilding or athletic purposes, as there are several types of insulin available, and choosing the correst type is of utmost imiportance. Basically there are 5 different types of insulin we'll look at, and from them, we'll pick the type which will best suit our purposes of building muscle:

-Humalog (Insulin lispro inj.) is the fastest acting insulin available

-Humulin-R (Regular Insulin) has a short duration of effect

-Humulin-N (Insulin Isophane) is intermediate length insulin

-Humulin-U(Medium Zinc Suspension) is another intermediate length insulin

-Humulin-U, utalente (Prolonged Zinc Suspension) is Long acting insulin

(*there are also blends available of two or more of these types of insulin, in varying ratios of Long:Short or anything in-between)

Of these 6 possible choices, the first would appear to be the best and safest, but that particular type of insulin is (unfortunately) only available with a prescription, and getting it through a typical steroid source (which usually means through the mail) is not advisable, since you can not be sure it has been properly stored and refrigerated throughout the shipping and handling process. Needless to say, attempting to forge a prescription for this stuff is an exceptionally poor idea.

Our next best choice for an injectable insulin is Humulin-R, so that's what we're going to be using. Humulin R is available without a prescription, from any pharmacy. This stuff has a fairly rapid onset and peak, and ergo is much easier to deal with than the other forms of insulin available…some last very long, or have varying peaks and spikes throughout their duration, and as such are just too difficult to monitor and control.

The first and most obvious way to utilize insulin for it’s anabolic effect is to take a little bit with each meal…possibly 1-2iu’s up to 5-6x a day (insulin is measured in international units, not mgs as is common with anabolic steroids). This way you’d be getting the greatest benefit of insulin possible with each meal, and the least risk of using too much and going into shock. Of course some bodybuilders have reported using up to 20-40iu/day, but I wouldn’t recommend this unless you are very experienced, and have your diet in perfect order. You’ll want to take in a tiny bit of essential fats, a decent amount of mixed carbs (i.e. carbs of varying glycemic indexes), and at least 40g of protein with each meal, when using this method of insulin use. And clearly, you’ll want to work up to this amount of insulin use, perhaps adding 1iu per day until you reach a level you are comfortable with. This holds true for either method of insulin use I’m presenting.

The second way you can use it is to take 1iu of insulin with your post workout meal, eventually working up to 1iu/10kgs of bodyweight. When using this method, you’ll want a post workout shake consisting of roughly 100-200g of mixed carbs and 40-50 grams of protein...and don’t forget a small amount of essential fats with your shake. I have used insulin this way, along with anabolic steroids and a thyroid med, and have found it to enhance the gains from my cycle by around 15-20% as compared with a similar cycle which did not include insulin.

The final method is to use the first method as well as the second. SO you’d be taking in 1-2ius with each regular meal and up to 1iu/10kgs of bodyweight with your post workout meal. This would ensure maximum efficiency from each bite of food you eat…but this way is also the most dangerous, and you need to monitor your blood sugar. If you get tired after a shot you’ll need to get some mixed carbs into you quickly (Gatoraid and a few Granola bars and/or candy bars)….it’s a good idea to carry those kinds of things around with you as insurance that your blood sugar doesn’t go too low. You also don’t want to take this stuff at night before bed, because you won’t know if your blood sugar is going low and that's making you drowsy (meaning you could be facing hypoglycemia, and about to go into a coma) or you are just tired because it’s your normal bedtime.

And as for that dirty little trick I was telling you about...a small amount of insulin may be taken when starting a cyclic ketogenic diet, with your first meal of the day you begin. This meal would be fats and proteins, without carbs, and only 2-4iu of insulin would be taken. The following meal, you can use half the dose of insulin as you did at your first meal.The result would be that you could be in ketosis before the end of that first day, wheras usually it would take 2 or even up to 3 days to accomplish this. Using insulin in this manner is very dangerous, and was even called "Death Wish Dieting" by Dan Duchaine....

Whichever method you use, remember to keep your insulin refrigerated, as Insulin will degrade very quickly outside of a refrigerated environment. Don't leave this stuff out of the fridge too long, either.

The other thing you don’t want to do is use regular needles to inject insulin. You NEED insulin pins to accurately dose this stuff…remember, too much can be deadly, and the syringes you would use to inject steroids are too big to measure out units of insulin with. Insulin is given via a subcutaneous injection (below the skin but above the muscle), and regular needles are just too big to do that.

Insulin (or at least Humulin-R) is currently not a controlled substance, and you should be able to buy it at your local drug store pretty cheaply: a 10cc multi-use vial dosed at 100iu/cc will cost you around $50.

 

[MotorCityMuscleMachine]

Kool brother, Good find // Good share.!

C- I told you guys 01 DS is alright, now back off...!

Lol..! Thanks brother...! Gonna read thru that at work, just waking up, gotta get my coffee, b4 my head starts pounding.

MotorCity

 

[01dragonslayer]

Kool brother, Good find // Good share.!

C- I told you guys 01 DS is alright, now back off...!

Lol..! Thanks brother...! Gonna read thru that at work, just waking up, gotta get my coffee, b4 my head starts pounding.

MotorCity

....are there rumors that I don't know about?...Lol.

 

[gesus]

thank you dragonslayer! very good read gave me enough info to come up with my own informed opinion for a protocol. I really appreciate that!

 

[Sciroxx]

I've been asked many times about the practice of combining insulin as well as Meformin with GH

The GH-IGF1 is possible the most complex hormonal axis in the human body. I'll try to offer some science based yet simple answers in a nutshell.
First how GH works in the human body -

Like explained by 01dragonslayer GH has some direct and immediate metabolic effects - it releases glucose and fatty acids to the circulation, meaning it takes stored energy and make it available for the different organs and tissues, this is how it increases metabolism and burns fat both directly (taking fat stored fat and turning it to free fatty acids) and indirectly by expending calories and energy consumption. Note that releasing glucose to the circulation requires the body to secrete insulin immediately in order to balance the glucose levels and lower them back to normal, this mechanism leads with time to decreased insulin sensitivity, as when taking superpharmacological levels of GH the body needs to secrete constantly high amounts of insulin. So GH increases insulin levels and decreases insulin sensitivity (which may bring to insulin resistance in extreme cases - diabetes). What some GH users do is incorporating exogenous insulin in order to help the body to cope with the high levels of glucose which are caused by the GH, the notion behind it is that the pancreas is a gland that if overwhelmed with demand to secrete constantly higher and higher insulin levels its functioning is harmed and deteriorate. I've seen some users raising the idea of eating high simple carbs meals instead of injecting insulin thinking it'll trigger the needed high insulin release from the pancreas, but this idea will only make things worst for the long run because it'll simply exhaust more the pancreas and impair its activity. What Metfomin does is enhancing the ability of the pancreas to regulate glucose levels and it increases insulin sensitivity, so it helps directly to this metabolic pathway, support insulin sensitivity directly helps the GH's effect, so this notion is productive

The ideal solution here is actually incorporating IGF1 to the equation. IGF1 directly increase insulin sensitivity, counter the insulogenic effect of GH, and more ever it directly add to the anabolic and anti catabolic effect of GH - as you may learn from the scientific literature below below the GH and IGF1 has a distinct synergistic effect, so combing them will enhance both the GH and the IGF1 effect by themselves -

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8853443
"GH may exert metabolic effects either directly or indirectly through increased production of IGF-I. GH administration increases circulating IGF-I levels via stimulation of hepatic synthesis and secretion of IGF-I; it may also enhance local IGF-I synthesis, which exerts paracrine or autocrine effects. Figure 2 summarizes the metabolic effects of GH and IGF-I. Administration of GH and IGF-I in adult humans has been demonstrated to enhance protein anabolism. Combined administration of GH and IGF-I was observed to be more anabolic than either IGF-I or GH alone. Evidence is presented that protein accretion results mainly from direct effects of GH on tissues; additional indirect effects via IGF-I production are also likely. Administration of GH has been reported to produce carbohydrate intolerance with elevated plasma insulin levels, resulting from insulin resistance. in contrast, insulin sensitivity increased during administration of IGF-I, which exerts hypoglycaemic effects even with concomitant suppression of insulin secretion. A major direct metabolic effect of GH is to increase fat mobilization and oxidation, and thereby to reduce total body fat; there is no evidence that IGF-I acts directly on adipose tissue in vivo. GH administration results in sodium retention via stimulation of Na-K-ATPase. It is suggested that part of the effects of GH on tubular function (e.g. phosphate reabsorption) are mediated via IGF-I. Energy expenditure may be increased by administration of either GH or relatively high doses of IGF-I. One of the reasons for this phenomenon is an increase in lean body mass; GH may increase energy expenditure additionally be enhancing the production of T3 and by increasing lipid oxidation"

 

[01dragonslayer]

I've been asked many times about the practice of combining insulin as well as Meformin with GH

The GH-IGF1 is possible the most complex hormonal axis in the human body. I'll try to offer some science based yet simple answers in a nutshell.
First how GH works in the human body -

Like explained by 01dragonslayer GH has some direct and immediate metabolic effects - it releases glucose and fatty acids to the circulation, meaning it takes stored energy and make it available for the different organs and tissues, this is how it increases metabolism and burns fat both directly (taking fat stored fat and turning it to free fatty acids) and indirectly by expending calories and energy consumption. Note that releasing glucose to the circulation requires the body to secrete insulin immediately in order to balance the glucose levels and lower them back to normal, this mechanism leads with time to decreased insulin sensitivity, as when taking superpharmacological levels of GH the body needs to secrete constantly high amounts of insulin. So GH increases insulin levels and decreases insulin sensitivity (which may bring to insulin resistance in extreme cases - diabetes). What some GH users do is incorporating exogenous insulin in order to help the body to cope with the high levels of glucose which are caused by the GH, the notion behind it is that the pancreas is a gland that if overwhelmed with demand to secrete constantly higher and higher insulin levels its functioning is harmed and deteriorate. I've seen some users raising the idea of eating high simple carbs meals instead of injecting insulin thinking it'll trigger the needed high insulin release from the pancreas, but this idea will only make things worst for the long run because it'll simply exhaust more the pancreas and impair its activity. What Metfomin does is enhancing the ability of the pancreas to regulate glucose levels and it increases insulin sensitivity, so it helps directly to this metabolic pathway, support insulin sensitivity directly helps the GH's effect, so this notion is productive

The ideal solution here is actually incorporating IGF1 to the equation. IGF1 directly increase insulin sensitivity, counter the insulogenic effect of GH, and more ever it directly add to the anabolic and anti catabolic effect of GH - as you may learn from the scientific literature below below the GH and IGF1 has a distinct synergistic effect, so combing them will enhance both the GH and the IGF1 effect by themselves -

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8853443
"GH may exert metabolic effects either directly or indirectly through increased production of IGF-I. GH administration increases circulating IGF-I levels via stimulation of hepatic synthesis and secretion of IGF-I; it may also enhance local IGF-I synthesis, which exerts paracrine or autocrine effects. Figure 2 summarizes the metabolic effects of GH and IGF-I. Administration of GH and IGF-I in adult humans has been demonstrated to enhance protein anabolism. Combined administration of GH and IGF-I was observed to be more anabolic than either IGF-I or GH alone. Evidence is presented that protein accretion results mainly from direct effects of GH on tissues; additional indirect effects via IGF-I production are also likely. Administration of GH has been reported to produce carbohydrate intolerance with elevated plasma insulin levels, resulting from insulin resistance. in contrast, insulin sensitivity increased during administration of IGF-I, which exerts hypoglycaemic effects even with concomitant suppression of insulin secretion. A major direct metabolic effect of GH is to increase fat mobilization and oxidation, and thereby to reduce total body fat; there is no evidence that IGF-I acts directly on adipose tissue in vivo. GH administration results in sodium retention via stimulation of Na-K-ATPase. It is suggested that part of the effects of GH on tubular function (e.g. phosphate reabsorption) are mediated via IGF-I. Energy expenditure may be increased by administration of either GH or relatively high doses of IGF-I. One of the reasons for this phenomenon is an increase in lean body mass; GH may increase energy expenditure additionally be enhancing the production of T3 and by increasing lipid oxidation"

Good info here...thanks brotha.

 

[gesus]

Awesome info [MENTION=698]Sciroxx[/MENTION] so are you suggesting only HGH + IGF-1 or both w/Metformin included?
I see you carry IGF-1 ! I might have to give this a try. I'm going to do my own research and post my findings back here. Hopefully keep this discussion going and continue to learn from those with more experience. You guys have been a great help

 

[Sciroxx]

Awesome info [MENTION=698]Sciroxx[/MENTION] so are you suggesting only HGH + IGF-1 or both w/Metformin included?
I see you carry IGF-1 ! I might have to give this a try. I'm going to do my own research and post my findings back here. Hopefully keep this discussion going and continue to learn from those with more experience. You guys have been a great help

IF you combine GH with IGF1 there is certainly no need for MEtformin. IGF1 unlike GH is cycled, so when you're off IGF1 (and still using GH) I would test glucose levels and if it exceeds 9-95 I would incorporate MEtformin for this period